I often hear women say good guys are hard to find. Interestingly I also know a lot of good guys who say they wish they had a girlfriend or wife, but they don’t have much luck with women. Where is the disconnect?
Women say it’s the men, men say it’s the women. But I think it’s more to blame on how gender relations have been turned upside down over the past 40 plus years than anything. Everything seems to be all backwards these days, and as far as I can see it’s not working out all that great, either!
I have even seen it in person. A former neighbor of mine has been chasing her “bad boy” for several years now. Meanwhile she on and off dates another guy who is a really great guy — and he thinks the world of her — but she says the attraction just isn’t there. He’s good looking, has a great job, is a devoted father to his kids (he’s divorced), I can’t see what there is NOT to be attracted to! (And of course, when her bad boy is out of the picture or has once again left her in the dust, who does she call?)
One thing I have noticed about good guys is they are often pretty subtle, as in they often act more like a friend than a romantic interest. In fact I myself have had guy friends, great guys, who in retrospect I realize probably were hanging out with me not for company but because they were hoping it would turn into something more. But without them ever “making a move” I truly believed (before the manosphere clued me in) that they actually just wanted to be friends. Apparently from what the guys have told me, single guys rarely hang out with ladies they have no attraction to.
So ladies, if you want a good guy, my advice would be to take a look around at the guy friends in your life who just might be waiting for you to send them the green light while you are clueless that they are interested. Of course we girls are told over and over not to make the first move, but the trouble is the good guys have been told not to be too pushy, or a creeper, or to harass the ladies. And so…usually nothing happens.
And have you ever noticed that bad boys, meanwhile, seem to have no problem harassing the ladies? I mean flat out brazen bold about it. And they are rarely without a female companion –or several at once! (That’s exactly why one of the main concepts of “game” is to teach good guys how to act more like bad boys!)
Anyway not that I have all this figured out myself but I do know this: there are lots of good guys out there who are currently single and completely being overlooked. They may not be the flashiest guys in the crowd, but the best kept secret is good guys make great boyfriends and husbands!
Maybe some of the good guys around here can enlighten us: how does a gal get a good guy to break the ice? Is it bad to make the first move? Do guys really want to be “just friends” with the gals they hang out with most of the time? Have the good guys just given up? What would it take to get them to take the chance and how to do it? I truly do think we ladies are missing something here…
Notes From a Red Pill Girl 
Thanks for telling the girls that good men are out there. This subject will take more thought. There is something that I heard recntly in a Captain Capitalism video. There are no good venues for men to meet women. He reccommended online dating, sadly.
I think it’s more to blame on how gender relations have been turned upside down over the past 40 plus years than anything. Everything seems to be all backwards these days, and as far as I can see it’s not working out all that great, either!
Well, yes. This is definitely true. You deserve an award. A real award. Not like those awards Feminists give to each other. Not even like that Nobel Prize that Obama received. Something better. I don’t know what it is yet.
https://spawnyspace.wordpress.com/2016/01/15/why-feminists-give-each-others-awards
I think you are right on the money with everything here!
I had sex once last year, and it was more than an effort to accomplish this for my personality. I’m a good guy. I don’t cat call, I don’t walk up to you in the bar with funny, great, or poor pickup lines, I don’t stalk you on the internet or text/call constantly until I get what I want.
Firstly, it isn’t the women. Though it is at least for me based on a tragic number of insecurities about women, that isn’t anyone’s problem or fault except mine really. Let me run though the facts which pretty much freeze me up into being only the most excellent friend she’s ever had and at the same time translate what my brain extrapolates from that:
1. Me: I’ve had two long term relationships only and I don’t really know what I’m doing with women. Her: Has a relationship whenever she chooses to have one and has plenty of experience with men.
2. Me: Kind of chubby and less than average looks. Her: Beautiful; why would she even bother.
3. Me: Had sex once last year, have no idea what I’m doing in bed. Her: Had sex every time she wanted it last year and has no time for someone who can’t please her.
4. Me: Has never hit on a woman outside of internet dating trials. Her: Hit on every day, if not sick of it then plenty of other better choices.
5. Me: Great well paying job, but takes a lot of my time and is boring to all women. Her: Not interested in dealing with my 24/7 schedule and wants someone who does something out of the ordinary and interesting.
6. Me: Came from a modest to poor childhood, I dress and live modestly. Her: Wants someone with a nice fashion sense, nice house, nice car.
7. Me: I’m nice, considerate, thoughtful, I listen, and don’t really have an interest in acting or appearing like a “bad boy.” Her: Wants to be excited, not bored.
And so on. I’m so self defeating at this point, I’m perfectly happy with having a female friend as at least that means I have some sort of female influence in my life that I can spend time with. I’m generally at the point now also where I don’t really think about them in the bedroom with me either.
I might be on the extreme side of the measure here, but here is one perspective 🙂
Why Are Good Guys So Hard to Find?
Perhaps Good Guys are not often rewarded for being Good Guys. Others notice. Incentives matter.
@ loveworldproblems:
You are on a red pill site sharing your situation. I’ll offer my take for what it’s worth.
You describe yourself as a nice, caring person in your 30’s. You also describe what in the sphere is known as a betta. If this terminology is new to you I suggest you read all the posts from these two blogs:
1. https://dalrock.wordpress.com/
2. http://therationalmale.com/
You describe your lady friend as a hb/9 or 10. Yet you are a chubby 6 betta. You are a nice guy and would no doubt make a wonderful husband and father. But your spec of desire is not into you. So why do you persist on wasting your limited time on her??
I recommend the following:
1. Continue working very hard at your good job. Live responsibly while hunting down your future wife. Save up cash in the bank.
2. Consider obtaining a wife from the Orient. Not The Philippines; the women from there are nuts.
3. Continue your exercise. In fact triple it and focus on weight training while reducing even more fat.
4. Don’t waste much money on American women! If you date a few, go cheap from the beginning. Don’t get them spoiled from day one. There is no reversing this once the spoilage occurs.
5. Don’t sum yourself up by being in, or not being in a relationship. A woman does not identify the man any longer. Feminism has rendered most women worthless in the wife role. Your not having a woman means absolutely nothing.
Related
http://bastionofliberty.blogspot.com/2016/01/the-numbers-game.html
@loveworldproblems thank you for sharing that, very candid example of what I am describing.
You’re more than welcome, I’m glad you posted it and that some women understand both 🙂
@poseidon740 – I’m quite familiar with the beta term 🙂 Though it sounds like I may be in terms of dating, the rest of my life is quite different. You wouldn’t think beta if you knew me at the office for example, nor on the Ice Rink 🙂
I wouldn’t consider my time spent with any friend, which is what we’re talking about here, a waste. At the very least I can learn more about how to interact and speak to all different kinds of women.
If it wasn’t for a couple of fractured back-bones, you bet your ass I’d be doing a lot more daily exercise too! Currently I can only do about 15 mins a day which is great as I’ve dropped 25kg recently. Though now it has only been able to maintain that new weight, I need to take it easy and let my body adjust before I can try to increase that in any meaningful way.
I am also not sure what you mean by hb/9 or 10? If it is a simple “rank” scale, yes, all women to me are a 9 or a 10 and that is my big problem. Not exactly all in my head, but mostly. As for my example, I know for a fact that 9 out of 10 women wouldn’t think what I typed after Her: – it was just an example of what runs through my head.
If women were turned on by “good guys” they’d not be moaning about the paucity of good guys, obviously. But they’re not.
What they want, of course, is Clooney (bad boy) in the safe, controllable wrapper of a local bank vice president. It’s a form of situational attraction: as though women (who feel entitled to be the gateway to sex) are wandering through an all-you-can-eat buffet of male attributes and virtues, and because Ms. Magazine and Sheryl Sandberg say “You can have it ALL!” they have lost the ability to say, “Thanks, I think I’ll just have a steak and a salad.”
Most women who have locked down their beta provider will justify an affair by saying it’s important to their self-actualization. It’s all just me-me-me impetuousness.
Most men who have their eyes open, and who decline to replace some sad-sack beta provider with cash and prizes, as well as their ability to drive her crazy with desire, will find themselves staring at an extremely confused female. Most women have never met a man who just says, “Hey, I just spent three decades being hammered into conformity with the idea that we’re all equal players on the stage of socio-sexual drama; tell you what, you take care of yourself and I’ll take care of myself. We’ll skip the part where I take care of you financially as I do my daughter.” Meltdown. Such a man will just move on. Pussy has been devalued by feminism to a point where often, it has negative value. It’s laughable, really, how most women think they can get all they want from a man by making it available.
It’s a form of deranged retail vertigo: too many choices reside in the hypergamous female imagination. The more advantaged bad boys, or alphas, or whatever you want to call them, might now be CEOs or artists or retired trained killers like Ton. They didn’t get to that position of social dominance by being idiots who hitch themselves to women who date like they shop at Walmart on Black Friday. They’re certainly not going to do so with a woman who thinks her magic vagina is the key to a man’s lifelong fulfillment. Men learn by age 12 that they can’t have it all. The modern woman is usually about 11, in emotional years.
@ bv good insights, as always 🙂
@ bv also, I do not think of you or Ton as bad boys in the derogatory sense, but as men who are consciously living lives of their own design. Although I am sure you are both plenty bad 😉 and neither of you lack for female company. By bad boys I mean like the one my former neighbor pines over, he’s cheated, lied, broken promises, smacked her about (although to be fair that was a two way street there, she was alter aging too) and more. Or maybe he’s smart not to get involved, as she’s quite good looking but probably had bpd and is a drama train wreck in her own right. Anyway… What I am saying is just bc a guy isn’t blue pill doesn’t make him not a good guy, to clarify. and agreed w you and Poseidon both that many women aren’t commitment worthy and/or the risks aren’t too high for guys. If that makes sense? In short I adore you and Ton both, and all you guys around these parts, if that’s not totally obvious already 🙂 you’re all great guys in my book!
In terms of making the first move, which doesn’t fit the romance novel pattern women prefer (being overwhelmed by a man’s interest and desire, so that the deed “just happened”), a woman needs to understand that it is her feminist culture that has educated men to understand that they’re predators who have imposed a rape culture on society.
If women were more self-aware, not to mention interested in critical, abstract thinking, they’d understand their own complicity. So yeah, with most betas and a lot of alphas with something to lose to a false accusation, a woman will need to sell a man on her trustworthiness and her sexual interest in him. Women carry very high potential liabilities to a man with something to lose.
Women love all the optionality they carry in the sexual marketplace, and the legal system, so none of them do anything about the world they created. Except complain a lot when men don’t do what they want.
Number of times I’ve been asked by a woman how I filter in my selection of woman friends? Zero. Number of times I’ve even been asked “What are you looking for?” Zero. They’ve been educated to believe that they are a winning Powerball ticket that they can assign to any male they choose. They have not been educated to understand that it’s not Powerball the men think they’re playing, but Russian Roulette.
Well, perhaps I just lied. One friend wanted to transition me into an explicit sugar daddy role, so she proposed a business arrangement; she did ask me what conditions I would apply to her if I accepted her terms. I appreciated her honesty, but when I declined her terms, she ended the relationship because she said she would fall in love with me and then be unable to enjoy her eventual sugar daddy, once she found him.
Another just kept bringing up her “security”, which she enjoys with her schlump sexually incompetent husband. I cared for her a great deal. She was very generous and attentive in unusual ways, with me — which indicates an awareness that men are more than dicks with a no-limit credit card. But when I finally asked her, “Okay, how much money per month are we talking about here, to maintain your lifestyle?” she lost her shit and accused me of treating her like a prostitute.
But at least both women were at least wondering what I wanted from them, even if the bottom line remained what they wanted from me.
At the moment I’m dating a socially conservative woman from a good family who belongs to a very conservative church. She’s hot, funny, reasonably bright, and self-supporting. One might think she might have longer-term potential, but she is blithely unaware of the impact of her prior behavior on me. For she sent the sheriff to her home to serve her ex-husband with divorce papers one day. They had never discussed divorce (I know this because I helped her brother-in-law at harvest, doing field work and hauling grain; he told me all about it, and the frantic look in his eye was that of a man who wondered if one day he’d get the same treatment). The guy was so surprised he just laughed and told the sheriff, “You’re at the wrong farm. My wife and I are not getting a divorce.” But it was his name on the paperwork, and yes, he was getting divorced.
@ Poseidon I like the shark avatar btw! 😉
Oops altercating, not alter aging.
Speaking of Ton, haven’t seen him around of late. Hopefully he’s just busy plundering and pillaging and plotting to take over the world, rather than ill or something…
All good observations BV and a side of the story a lot of women I know are totally unaware of. Good points!
I use the term “bad boy” simply to mean “men who do not conform.” I am a bad boy, for instance, in these parts because no one can figure out WTF I’m doing here or what I used to do in DC and parts unknown. And I’m single, look 10 or 20 years younger than the farmers my age, and will challenge the pastor on scriptural interpretation. So the good betas at church are nervous around me, and the women are curious. I do not conform to the social norm.
You didn’t ask, but have you ever noticed that men don’t pathologize other men, to explain their behavior? Half of the illnesses women ascribe to themselves or others are made-up fictions designed to explain away personal responsibility for female behavior. I reference “as she’s quite good looking but probably had bpd and is a drama train wreck in her own right.” Maybe she’s just an immature bitch with zero self-control or thinking ability. It’s this thinking that has put 70 million Americans on psychotropic meds, 90 percent of them female: see, they’re all just misunderstood medical victims. This elevates their status.
I was trying to get drunk the other night and watch a basketball game, and the cutie 24 year-old bartender was intent on telling me all about her “medical” issues, and how her doctor had never met anyone so hyperactive with such stunning ADHD. She just glowed with pride. This was her idea of flirting; she had to move on to the next customer to get her validation. It’s very common.
I had another date recently with a divorcing woman of some means and privilege, and on this FIRST DATE she told me all about her father’s alcohol abuse which had scarred her irretrievably so she had to attend Al-Anon and her estranged husband, obviously, had snared her because she didn’t realize she was trying to replace her Bad Dad with a replicant, and how her therapy plus Al-Anon was making her a free woman at last blah blah blah. Another made-for-TV movie about another woman rendered ILL, ILL I SAY! by the patriarchy. I suggested we just have appetizers, and I got the fuck out of there pronto. Three days later the woman who introduced us emailed me and said, “So-and-So had a great time and would love to go out again.” Are you kidding me?
Anyway, women who pathologize female behavior, instead of owning that behavior, are a red flag. Not every man has terminal White Knight syndrome.
@ bv love it. And yes you are right about the former neighbor. Perhaps by saying she’s a bpd train wreck I was trying to be polite about saying what it really is. I have noticed women seem either hardwired or taught very young not to call each other out on their stuff too directly, maybe it’s that herd mentality or in group or whatever at play? Interesting… But yes you are right about her and that good guy hung up on her would be best off saving himself while he still can! I have tried to subtly say that but so far he’s set on going down w that ship, white knight flag flying…
Maybe rather than alpha or beta or good guy or bad guy what it really is, is red pill or blue pill?
Here’s a laughable “study” that surveyed a bunch of early 20’s women as to “what women want.” The women proceed to lie and promote the trope that they just want “a good man” overflowing with generosity and kindness.
Only a few problems here:
None of these “women” have ever been in a longterm relationship with a man they’re not physically attracted to. When they find a dope to marry them, their marriage will be sexually sterile within five years. Note that the women openly admit that they don’t bother with “altruistic” men at present, just hawt dudes. The generous provider they plan to lock down will appear, they say, later when they are ready to settle down. This follows the Sandberg/Rollo Open Hypergamy life model to a T. They’re all, explicitly, planning to be alpha widows who game a rich provider when it’s baby-time.
Repeat: None of these women date “altruistic” men, and neither they nor the study has the thinking ability to note the irony (let alone moral bankruptcy) of women screwing attractive men while expressing their eventual personal entitlement to their very own “altruistic” beta provider.
Fortunately, the author of the piece got his rocks off commenting about “bitter guys on the Internet whose resentment toward women stems from romantic rejection.” See how that easy it is? Anyone who disagrees with socio-sexual lies is irrational, i.e., “bitter.” Conform to the Feminine Imperative and get in harness dudes! He even tells disbelievers to shut up: “Instead of wasting time writing nasty comments …”
The guy who wrote this tripe is either gay or getting starfish duty sex once a month from a bored wife. It takes even a reserved (non-PUA) red pill man about $50 bucks and an hour of conversation, to get laid. Manginas, like the complaining single women, are projecting big-time when they talk about “bitter men”. As noted philosopher Aretha Franklin explained, “Who’s fooling who?”
Whoops:
http://www.businessinsider.com/what-women-look-for-in-a-man-2016-1?utm_content=bufferc0af2&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer
Thanks for sharing that BV. Yes it certainly is a blue pill white knight take on what the study showed. And the author is indeed very condescending, not very altruistic of him! 😉
Why don’t women recognize the good guys? Because the good guys are not confident, charismatic or even particularly attractive. Why are they attracted to the “bad boys” so much? Because the bad boys tend to be confident, charismatic and attractive. In fact, it’s their confidence and charisma that makes them attractive; not the fact they’re “bad boys.”
The next problem the women have is a completely inflated idea of their real sexual market value (SMV). Why do women on OK Cupid rate 80% of men’s photos as “below average?” Because the women think they are so much hotter than they really are. All a woman has to do is take a look at her beta orbiters, take the average of their SMV and that’s what HER SMV is. Seriously… the only reason the whole “BBW” thing has any traction at all is because there are so many thirsty betas out there that will take whatever they can get as long as it spreads its legs.
Women want guys to “get it” and understand that if a woman has to tell a guy what he’s supposed to do, it completely kills the attraction. Sometimes the thing that most attracts them to a guy (quite often, in fact) is that she cannot manipulate him. A guy who walks away from pussy on a plate because it’s all about him and what he wants is a guy she wants to be with.
Women shit test men all the time with sexual language and innuendo. That’s because the thirsty beta will always take the bait and that’s why laughing at them and saying something like “thanks for the Kinsey report” works so much better.
I would not send any nice guys to Dalrock’s blog to learn how to be more successful with women. It’s totally a discussion of the problems with wimenz and not one iota of productive solutions… and all a guy will get out of that is the conviction that women are completely evil. Not a little bit, but completely evil. AWALT.
Not saying you should send them to my blog, ’cause you know I’m not exactly a fan of monogamy. But it’s interesting how effective being vocal about polygyny is when it comes to interacting with women. What really amazes other people is watching a woman’s reaction when I flat out tell her the only way I’d be interested in dating her was if she brought along a friend that’s just as cute as she is. About 75% of the time that sparks interest and massive shit testing.
Raised eyebrows. “Why would I need to bring a friend?” (Shit test #1)
“Oh.” [Knowing look] “I’m sorry. Obviously you’ve never been in a threesome.”
“OMG! Is this like a fantasy of yours?” (Shit test #2)
“Well, having to ask what the friend is for makes your lack of experience obvious, but that’s OK, with enough help you’d probably be able to figure out what to do. Or does that mean you don’t have any girlfriends that would be up for something like that?”
“Oh- like I’m not good enough for you by myself?” (Shit test #3)
“Honey, after you’ve experienced certain combinations, things just aren’t the same one on one, and that goes for everybody involved.” [Knowing look with smirk] “You’d know that if you’d ever tried it.” [Hand her my card] “Here. I’m busy right now, but we can text later.”
I either walk away or turn away, effectively dismissing her. In the past year of doing that it’s been very successful at getting women to contact me (often texting me immediately so I have their number) and I’ve even had women I’ve never met before walk up to me and start conversations about my aversion to monogamy. That happened once while I was at the bakery having coffee with my *mother* and let me tell you, she was completely flabbergasted. Understand, my mother is a Baptist Sunday-school teacher, a Southern Belle’s Belle (think “Driving Miss Daisy”) and she’s now completely convinced the women of today have gone to hell in a handbasket.
I occasionally make it a point to drop in on her if I’m with more than one woman, and that’s always good for getting on her knees and putting in at least an hour of prayer for me after I leave. I obviously need all the prayer I can get. I either wind up with prudes that want babies or crazies that will give me anything I want *except* babies. I suspect the problem is I’m not screening them hard enough, but it’s just so much fun watching their little hamsters blow up and start doing backflips that I bring it on myself.
But… the thing is, women are so much more fun when there’s 2 or 3 of them together, that one on one is kind of boring now with anything but an exceptional woman. And groups are lots more fun for the women too. Out with a singleton, we wouldn’t get any attention. With a pair, we get some attention. With 3 or 4 we get a *lot* of attention and they eat that up.
Anyway, I will now share my time-tested “nice guy – bad boy” game that lets a guy be a nice guy and a bad boy, all at the same time, in such a way that gives the women excitement, thrills and adventure. Bloom, you may not believe this, but my all-time favorite activity is not sex or even shooting (although both are *very* high on the list). It’s actually locating the meanest, nastiest person I can find and doing something really nice for them without getting caught. Then breaking out the popcorn and watching them go nuts trying to figure out who did it. It always requires help, which means a conspiracy. It takes work, planning, surveillance, proper time management, excellent leadership and a firm adherence to the 11th Commandment: Thou Shall Not Get Caught.
Interestingly, the vast majority of my victims have been crotchety old cat women living on social security. My all-time best ever was just such an old woman who was meaner than a snake and the only predictable time she ever left her house was to go to church. One of my buddies (former Army airborne who owned a construction company) and I decided it would be one hell of a lot of fun and a real challenge to put a new roof on the shack she was living in. We get bored with everyday life. So what?
All the guys that worked for him volunteered along with half the wives and we put more planning into that operation than the D-Day invasion of France. Multiple visits to measure and rehearse. Lookouts on the road in both directions with radios and cell phone numbers on speed-dial for backup. All the material pre-cut, marked and stacked in the right order. Everybody had their assigned jobs and knew what they had to do, when and where. The right day finally came and we knocked it out in a little under an hour, cleaned up the mess, got away and nobody saw us. We even raked the dirt so there were no footprints. She got home, found a new shiny metal roof on her house and just about had an apoplectic fit. I know because my buddy and I were hiding in the bushes watching when she got home.
Trying to figure out who did it practically killed that woman and it even made the local paper (she filed a complaint with the sheriff about the “damage” to her house). A few months later the sheriff was “in the area” and dropped in “to do some politicking” seeing as how he was running for re-election. We sat on the porch and had some sweet-tea while he gave me his stump speech. As he was leaving he mentioned that my crazy neighbor-lady up the hollow a ways had filed a criminal complaint because *somebody* put a new roof on her house. She filed a complaint so he was bound to investigate, but it turned out there wasn’t a witness to be found that could tell him anything and *somebody* didn’t leave one shred of evidence. Then he smiled and said it did his heart good to know the Army and Marines could cooperate on keeping the 11th commandment and it would sure as hell be nice if it stayed that way. I assured him the Army and Marines always cooperated when they had a common enemy. He nodded, waved and left.
Now, this is not only one hell of a lot of fun, but I’ve found that women absolutely love doing stuff like that and they totally get the concept of “we can’t get caught doing this.” It’s right up there with skinny-dipping in the neighbor’s pool at 3 AM. They’re also really good at surveillance (probably from stalking guys). Women that are so lazy they won’t wash their car will mow a lawn with a push mower at top speed or scrub windows like crazy while getting soaked by the pressure washer if it’s part of pulling off a good deed without getting caught for someone who absolutely does not deserve it. Especially if they know the person and despise them. Women are weird that way, but I’ve come to the conclusion that for women there’s something romantic about a conspiracy.
The general idea for this comes from the Bible and combines two important Biblical concepts: “Give your enemy a cold drink if they are thirsty or food if they are hungry and it will be like pouring hot embers on their head” and “When you give, do not your left hand know what the right hand is doing.” The hot embers thing is satisfying but doing it anonymously just adds to the fun when they find out what happened. The trick is knowing enough about the victim to do something really nice that will drive them crazy. Again, women love this kind of conspiracy stuff.
So… Bloom, I have to ask you something. (Silly girl, relax. You’re way too nice for *that* kind of question)
Am I the “bad boy” evil toad, or am I the good guy with some rough edges who likes to have way more fun than ordinary people? Just curious.
loveworldproblems,
Here is a set of posts that get you started in learning what is happening,
https://spawnyspace.wordpress.com/2015/02/08/red-pill-classroom-the-beta/
https://spawnyspace.wordpress.com/2015/01/10/the-red-pill-classroom-an-introduction-to-the-red-pill/
https://spawnyspace.wordpress.com/2015/02/02/the-red-pill-classroom-the-alpha/
https://spawnyspace.wordpress.com/2015/01/31/the-red-pill-classroom-five-minute-rule-alpha-widow/
https://spawnyspace.wordpress.com/2015/01/17/red-pill-classroom-the-rationalization-hamster/
https://spawnyspace.wordpress.com/2015/01/02/the-red-pill-classroom-nawalt/
https://spawnyspace.wordpress.com/2015/01/01/red-pill-classroom-bad-boys/
https://spawnyspace.wordpress.com/2015/01/04/the-red-pill-classroom-the-feminine-imperative/
https://spawnyspace.wordpress.com/2015/02/20/red-pill-classroom-shit-tests/
I guess you could call me a “good guy” in the sense that I think women are wonderful and make life much more enjoyable when you have them around. That doesn’t mean that I am not good at the art of seduction. No one would ever label me a “bad boy” but what women have labeled me with is words like “Charming” “Charismatic” “Intelligent” “Witty” “Talented”. If you want quality women and great intimate relationships these are the kind of words most good guys can have spoken of them if they just view women as an emotional beings, get better at conversation (read how to win friends and influence people), and stop supplicating thinking it will lead to intimacy.
I used to be a “good guy” in the sense that I had little success with the ladies when I was younger (teens and early 20’s) I managed to have a few sexual partners that were very attractive, but those took time to develop and my game was terrible. I had very high social proof (I was a member of the most elite male organization at my college) was elected into the highest positions within that group, but still no ladies. One of the reasons was because I drank to much, but that is another story all together.
Flash forward 12 years later. I worked really hard at self improvement, lifted weights for the last 5 years, got a better sense of style, and worked my ass off to become a physician in one of the most elite medical specialties (I just finished so I was poor while training and I still did well with the ladies). One of my biggest weaknesses is I’m not tall..I only stand 5’6 and this is a deal breaker for so may girls these days. While on this journey I have still seduced many beautiful, pleasant, caring, intelligent, and passionate women. I would have never dreamed I would have had this kind of success back in college. The difference between me and so many of these other red pill men (I consider myself red pill as I know the nature of women) is there attitude of disgust with women. All of the onetime flings, short relationships, and even women who I didn’t sleep with, but I almost did are still a part of my life in someway. I found something unique in all of them and they still feel very positive about the experiences we shared together. Good guys can become an object of desire, they just have to learn how improve on there charisma, live a healthy lifestyle, and have goals and a purpose. You can be a jerk and that will lead to success with women, but that success is superficial, there is no true intimacy in that approach.
Another thing all the good guys need to learn is how to move things along physically with women. Inherently, deep down, women do not get the tingles for guys who are not good at taking the lead and getting physical. If you don’t test the water and cup their elbows while talking, invade there personal space a little while conversing then back away, look at there lips when in close and let them know you want to kiss them, and then take the lead and go for a kiss, you will never generate the kind of tingles in her that will lead to passionate sex.
Trust me when I say this, you don’t have to be a jerk to get women, you just have to learn how to seduce them..give them an experience they can’t forget inside and outside the bedroom. You don’t have to think poorly of women and their nature to succeed with them, you just have to improve yourself, apply learned charisma, and don’t be shy about getting physical, and I assure you wonderful intimate experiences with them.
Btw red pill girl, I love your blog and think it should be required reading for girls in the early teen years.
Women today are still on an entitlement hunt. Having been told all their lives to hold out for better, they have no scale upon which to judge the value of the men approaching them. Unless he walks up dripping of wealth, her friends are going to downplay him and tell her she can do better.
This IS going to change, and before too much more time passes. My next post at Spawny’s Space (scheduled for 1/18/16 @ 00:30 BST) touches on this as it affects women in a specific place, and another in the works will expand on the reasons more generally.
Suffice it to say that a man’s value increases dramatically upon her necessities.
when her bad boy is out of the picture or has once again left her in the dust, who does she call?
That man played the fool. Even in my “bluest of blue pill” days if I was interested in a girl and there was so much as a hint of her spending time with another guy, she was no longer someone I was interested in.
@ Toad that’s awesome re the neighbor lady’s roof! Lol. Lots of good points in your comment, the beta orbiter = her true smp value could be a post in itself, very true! As far as the rest, yes I am sure you have your mom not only praying herself but I am sure they’ve likely go a whole prayer chain dedicated to pleading upon your behalf. Your mom sounds like a nice lady! I will likely comment more later, busy day today. Carry on w your bad self….
2. Consider obtaining a wife from the Orient. Not The Philippines; the women from there are nuts.
No they are not. SOME filipinas are nuts, so are some of the women from every other Asian country (and most women from every Western country). Typically filipinas make good wives. As always, vet very carefully no matter where you shop. I do agree, however, that the Orient is a good place to shop.
@ bebop thank you re the teen girls, I often picture my own soon to be young ladies a n’s what I want them to understand before they launch out into the world. Lots of great observations in your comment to ponder –thanks for adding to the discussion! 🙂 and welcome!
@ blurkel I will look forward to reading that. I suppose in some ways gals only naturally take the current smp/mmp advantages/options for granted as “the way it is” but as you say it’s true the way it is currently is only for the moment and could (and likely will) change in time. Nature seeks balance, always and cultural norms are very fluid.
AT – All women ARE evil.
So are men, but everybody already knows that. No one likes to admit that women are evil too.
Jdg as it should be. I don’t get it myself…
@ jdg true this, all fall short! Women included.
Another thing to discussion, you ask how girls get the good guys to like them. The problem with this lies in ingrained human courtship behaviors that have existed in primates going back to our ancestors. However, modern social programming these days has disrupted the normal rituals.
1. Men are not being raised to be masculine anymore and guided by there male peers and fathers properly on male courtship displays.
2. Girls are being taught to be ruled by their tingle above all else and to not use rational thought when it comes to mate choice.
This mismatch has lead to good guys getting passed over because girls used to have a list of social pressures to value certain traits over strictly the tingle generators.
If a girl wants to land a good guy she must first realize instant attraction and chemistry may not be present. She has to get over the idea this has to exist for a possible long term mate. She will have to overtly flirt and not be afraid to suggest doing activities with him before he suggests this, thus placing her in the role of possible rejection (which has been historically been a mans domain). She cannot be upset and immediately lose interest when the guy doesn’t escalate things physically when she gives him the opportunity. She has to have realistic expectations about physical attributes such as height and attractiveness.
Other answers, guys do not want to be “just friends” if he is always hanging around you, he just doesn’t have the experience to know how to physically escalate, if you make a move on these guys they will typically jump at the opportunity, but don’t expect great sex from the start.
Good guys haven’t given up, many of them just feel so disenfranchised seeing there friends chase guys who mistreat them that they start to harbor resentment towards women and the men who date them.
Girls have to pursue god guys like they wish to be pursued. The problem with this is that it goes against the primitive courtship rituals of our species. Men need to be taught from a young age by their fathers and peers you don’t have to be a jerk to get girls, you just have to learn to take the lead.
To answer the question posed by the title of this post, it seems to be a lament from older women. In their youth, thay, and their contemporaries, could get away with treating men badly.With youth, there is a disparity in sexual markrt value that advantages women. Add acoupl;e of decades and it flips, advantaging men. In the intervening years, men have had a lot of bad experiences and seen worse. How this plays out is different. While the girls will overtly reject men when they make advances, men will not put themselves out there.
Loveworldproblems,
Farm Boy left you good links.
Buena Vista,
Your comments are golden.
when her bad boy is out of the picture or has once again left her in the dust, who does she call?
Dunno. These guys?
I would agree Bevo!
@ fuzzie very true! Thanks for adding that…
The problem with nice guys is that they are creepy. That’s why we don’t talk about fight club around them. Girls don’t tingle for nice guys. Nice guys don’t understand what girls want!!!! Nice guys want to believe that girls want nice guys.
“I’m generally at the point now also where I don’t really think about them in the bedroom with me either.”
This attitude is likely to get you laid at some point. Zero Fucks Given is pussy catnip!
I was dancing with a girl last night and her hands were all over me–my back, my side, the top of my butt, and she wanted to hold hands. Not during dancing, but when walking off the dance floor. She wanted to touch and be touched. I had to stop dancing with her for the night.
Why was she interested in me? I had told her a story about something that had happened to me recently and the story involve me touching a girl’s butt. (The girl in the story was VERY pretty and that girl had flirted with me first.) A man who is willing to sexualize and take risks is always hot to women.
Lesson: Girls are turned on around hot guys. They throw their panties at rock & roll drummers, not at physicians.
@asdgamer
Lesson: Girls are turned on around hot guys. They throw their panties at rock & roll drummers, not at physicians.
That isn’t true! I know at least one woman who threw her panties at her OB-GYN because the speculum was ice-cold. It was the only thing she had to throw at him.
@ toad throwing the bs flag on that one, by the time you realize things are ice cold in that situations the panties are long gone!
After hearing that one, I am glad that I am a boy bear.
Back up at the beginning of this thread, I made a point about how Captain Capitalism thinks online dating, as bad as it is, is the mo9stt effective venue for men and women to mett. That might have some bearing on this discussion.
Bloom, I was married to her. Claims she was holding her panties in her hand. I believed her then and still do (she throws things. Always has, probably always will)
Bloom, there are Blue Pill alphas and Red Pill betas. Alphas are always “bad boys” to some degree. Women call greater betas “good guys” because they have some sexual attractiveness yet are willing to submit, er, commit to a woman.
Ok Toad, perhaps so… In my experience the clothes are ditched for a wrap style robe prior to any exam but I’ll leave it at that. 😉
Yes Fuzzie, be glad you are a guy!
@ gamer I see, that makes sense. I do know several “naturals” who have had much luck with the ladies from an early age but yet they are blue pill and rather clueless overall to any of this at the same time and so are rather easily led about by their female companions and so yes, beta in many ways despite their luck w the ladies romance wise…
I won’t introduce another wall of text, but I have a second take on the question “Where have all the good guys gone?”
They’ve gone anywhere they don’t run into women who say, “Where have all the good guys gone?”
***
Bevo, you seem to want to virtue signal and this introduces a lot of straw men fallacies into your arguments and examples, which are otherwise strong. Nobody said, for example, that you have to be “a jerk” to be either successful with, or desired by, women. Likewise, being “disgusted” by various permutations of the Feminine Imperative may well be appropriate. Get back to us after you’ve observed a few divorces involving family or close friends. With luck, one of them won’t be your own.
Here’s an example of proto-feminist behavior that is deservedly labeled “disgusting.”
A friend is a gyn-onc. That’s a cancer doctor focused on lady parts. She’s one of two in a two-state region, on the board of her hospital system, the very emodiment of the Strong Independent Woman. For kicks, while working full-time, she got a Duke MBA. I got her into flying, and now she has her private ticket and her own plane. AND, she’s hand-building a plane herself.
She’s currently defending herself from an ethics complaint.
It seems that she had a patient, a single mother who runs a “childcare” business out of her home. She has cancer and needed a hysterectomy. A slight problem: She weighs 535 pounds. (Not a misprint.) She’s so fat there isn’t a machine available for humans that can scan her. My doctor friend called the Omaha Zoo (not a misprint) to see if they have one for animals that she could employ.
My friend successfully performed the operation on the second try, using robotics, obviously. (That’s a lot of blubber to traverse to get to the target.) In the post-op she mentioned that the woman needed to take command of her health, lose 350 pounds, and not assume that constrained resources would continue to be available to keep her alive, if she was unwilling to stop eating 10 pizzas a day. (She and I agreed that this was as stupid as giving a liver transplant to someone who refuses to stop drinking himself to death, and indeed, I know a guy who needs a liver, but has been told he has to be dry for 12 months before he will be eligible. He’s still drinking.)
Well. The hippo-female filed an ethics complaint against my ob-gyn because “I used to like myself but Dr. X made me feel ashamed for being a little heavy.”
Fat-shaming is a feminist construct. I regard Dr. X as a heroic, as well as superior, human being. She is everything feminists once said they wanted women to achieve. She is defending herself from a land-whale who’s watched too much daytime tv, and imbibed the talking point that all women are beautiful, special creatures, deserving of expensive handouts funded by other people.
As a footnote, why isn’t the State’s child services bureaucracy removing the children from her “care”? Probably because they’re too busy targeting divorced fathers.
Kind of like this guy she was.
Though Jabba a virtue he did have.
Green he was
Looking back at BV’s comments, women are presuming a rigged sexual marketplace will advantage them over the course of their lives and it will always be that way. I am reminded of the oil market. During the 70s OPEC had the upper hand. In the 80s, people got serious about conservation. Consumers can only stand so much.
http://inflationdata.com/Inflation/Inflation_Rate/Historical_Oil_Prices_Table.asp
Plenty of good guys just stopped being good guys. When people complain about me being an asshole I stop the fuck fuck games and get straight with them. I tell them that I was a nice guy once, and I got compliments on how nice I was after I got thrown down and kicked around. Now that I am an asshole, people do what I want after they complain how much of an asshole I am. Which do you think I am going to choose? So what that you call me fuckface behind my back; you still cleaned up that mess and got me that thing I needed. They look ashamed, then they agree with me. They know.
A woman asking where the good men are deserves as much serious consideration as aging women asking if they are pretty. They know the answer. All they are looking for is reassurance. If they are asking, it is because they know they fucked it up, and they do not want to admit it.
The Shadowed Knight
I’d consider you beta from your emotes alone, but your language reeks of qualify-through-logic which is a classic beta tell.
Masculinity is forged in the fires of pain and discomfort. Whether lifting weights, going to war, or taking on martial arts, the end goal is the same – to reach for a higher calling and challenge yourself.
Sure, hockey will certainly help your masculinity when it comes to socializing with other men, and even gain you social proof with the ladies, but unless you climb into the trenches of male/female romance you will just be that “nice hockey player” guy.
My suggestion is to flirt with women. All women. Personally, I treat all women the same regardless of age or beauty.
Teasing, laughing, joking, these thing excite their day. Then, when one is interested she will turn up the heat, meaning she will test your testicular fortitude. After your delusions of females dissapate, you will quit caring about what they say and start caring about what she does. Once you don’t care whether or not she cares… you win.
I wonder how good this book is,
http://www.amazon.com/Is-He-Worth-It-Hidden/dp/0990686426
Where are the good men?
Good men are everywhere, and they are looking for terrific women. So why are they hard to find? And why do so many women make life-altering mistakes by choosing the wrong men?
The answer is distressingly simple. Good men don’t always know how to attract women, and women don’t always recognize good men.
But don’t despair! Is He Worth It? holds time-tested wisdom for spotting good men who are searching for great relationships. You’ll learn…
• The three pillars of a good man. Men of character possess these basic traits.
• The twelve-point man inspection. This quiz will help you evaluate his relationship readiness.
• Ten self-deceptions that lead to costly relationship errors. Find out how to avoid common mistakes women make when choosing men.
Written by a happily married man who is also a clinical psychologist, Is He Worth It? is a sweet celebration of romance, and it’s the perfect guide to finding love in these complex times.
Good men, like good women, aren’t going to jump into bed with someone right off the start. Long-term relationships don’t appear overnight (or in bed in a few minutes). If you read management journals – it takes 2 years of “storming and norming” before company teams become stable and good at working together – why would anyone expect a *real* relationship (where it’s for *life*, and not just for as long as you both work at that company) to form faster than that?
There’s a saying I’ve heard from women: “There’s guys you date and guys you marry”. The same is true, the other way around. If you’re a man or a woman – if you’re looking for marriage, you need to be the kind of person that someone would want to marry (vs. date). Are you “fun” vs. “the person who’s there in a crisis”? If someone sees you not take care of your long-term friends and friendships – why would the expect you to take care of them?
Marriage is all about the “or worse” part of “for better or worse”. Almost any marriage can survive good times…
I wouldn’t marry a woman who’s not there for her friends & family in the bad times – and if she’s got nobody who thinks enough of her to be there in her bad times – maybe there’s a reason…
I have a saying: “What you catch is pretty much determined by what you use for bait, and where you go fishing”. If you’re not finding the quality you’re looking for – maybe you’re doing something wrong, vs. all the single men on the planet doing something wrong. And it might just be that assumption that “all men are bad” that’s keeping the good ones from wanting to be around you.
If you badmouth your friends, if you aren’t there for them, if you are rude or take advantage of people who can’t fight back, if you have a chip on your shoulder, or are someone who says “all people of the opposite sex are X” – you’re not going to be pleasant for the good people of that sex to be around – they’ll just say nothing and move on.
Be the kind of person you’d want to date and marry – and the kind of person you want to date and marry will find you.
Good advice, HuMe! Thanks for adding that 🙂
Women only want scumbags, As a supposed “good guy” with a college degree, 6 figure salary, car and homeowner, I don’t even bother dating anymore. Tired of being called a “Loser” for having a good credit score while she runs off to chase the fun and exciting methamphetamine dealer down the street.
B, I can see why you would feel that way. I hope you find a high quality woman who sees you for what a catch you are. Those other ladies sound like fools, to me.
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The very sad thing is that many women will go with men that are Losers just like them which really speaks for itself. So it is very obvious why many of us Good men just Can’t meet a Good woman anymore these days. Back in the 50’s and 60’s Most women were certainly so much Nicer and a lot Easier to meet in those days which Most of them Really made a much Better wife back then and were very Faithful to their men as well when Most men were just as Faithful too. Today since many women now have their Careers Most of them are very high maintenance, independent, selfish, spoiled, greedy, picky, cheaters, and very power money hungry too since they only would want the Best and will Never settle for Less which certainly makes them very Pathetic now Unfortunately. So many of us men can Never Blame ourselves at all for the kind of women that are now out there today that really is keeping us Single now which Most of the Good old fashioned women of years ago were the Best at one time compared to today. Since it really does take two to tangle which many of us men are really Not Single by choice.