A gal I know through work has been talking of getting a divorce as long as I have known her. And for as long as I have known her, I have been giving her good reasons why she may want to reconsider.
She’s 35, together 15+ years, married 10 years, has four children (two from a previous relationship, two with her husband.) The oldest is 19, the youngest is 8. She’s been a stay at home mom since they married with the odd job here and there. They aren’t wealthy but they have a nice life, their own home, and enough money to pay the bills each month.
Now don’t get me wrong, I am not saying there is never a reason to divorce, but I have probed and asked and as far as I can see or she is telling me, she is not being abused, he’s not an addict, he isn’t cheating. He goes to work every day, comes home right after, tries to make her happy and provide the things she wants, and is a good father to their children.
So what is the problem? I have written about her situation before but in a nutshell it seems to be a combination of she is bored, she’s frustrated with her own life, she and her husband are engaged in an ongoing power struggle that is killing the relationship, and rather than take steps to remedy the situation she endlessly fantasizes about getting divorced, instead.
I have shared with her what a struggle it can be to be a single mom, to be solely responsible for the family finances, the family chores, and most of the childcare. It’s a stressful and uncertain life, and I often worry about what would happen to my family if something happened to me?
Yet, she still didn’t seem to be hearing any of that. Until another friend of hers sent her the link to a message board of women who are either going through the divorce process or who are recently divorced. I believe her friend thought this message board would help her figure out how to get a divorce too, but it has had the opposite effect.
She’s lurked for hours on the message board, reading the stories of these women and their experiences.
Instead last time I saw her, she admitted she’s not thinking divorce is the solution she once did. It seems after reading real life divorce tales firsthand, she’s decided she doesn’t want to put herself, her kids, or her family through that. And it seems reading about the marriage struggles and problems experienced by other women, her situation suddenly doesn’t seem nearly so bad by comparison.
Another version of this might be going down to the local courthouse and spending a day sitting in and listening to family court.
No marriage is perfect. No marriage is all upside with no negatives. And yes, some marriages are bad news. But many times divorce may not be needed and in fact may be more difficult than repairing fixable issues.
I am happy my friend is reconsidering. I think she’s making a wise choice. I hope she will now spend as much time thinking about how to make her marriage better (and doing those things) as she once did thinking about how she was going to get out of it.
Notes From a Red Pill Girl 
I am glad that someone finally found a way to get through to her. I think she should treat her loyal, hard working hubby like gold because there is not replacing him with someone of equal motivation. You should recommend this forum to anyone who may contemplate divorce. It can’t help but make everyone worse off, except the attorneys.
Ugh… I can add an awful lot to the reasons why being apart makes no sense. Everything from financial, to logistical, to effects on the children, and even towards retirement planning. I sent a very long letter to someone laying this all out for them.
In a nutshell, they were each being selfish and couldn’t see what everyone else did about their continuing non-but-actual-relationship.
They were back together less than 2 months later.
I’d go in to greater detail, but I don’t need it tracked back to me.
Oh, and link to the message board please?
i’m sure you just want to scream, “FINALLY!!!”
finally … a woman wisened up THIS side of the line rather than on the other.
OOOOOHHHH! I see part of the issue here, and it is one I’ve seen fairly often. Your friend gave birth at 15/16 years old or so. She probably feels like she missed out on having “her time”, and wants to capture it before it’s too late. I know a few who have blown up a decent family in this exact same scenario.
Ame,
I think you expressed my sentiments better than I did. bloom has brought up this woman a few times and nothing has gotten through to her until now.
RPG,
If you want to kep the site a secret, that is fine with me. I am just glad there is something out there that works. If it needs to stay confidential, that’s fine with me.
She didn’t tell me the name of the divorce support website, but I will try to find out….
She may be 37 now that I think about it, but yes she was a teen mom
Reason number 1
You may NEVER EVER EVER EVER AS IN FOREVER
have carefree no pressure sex EVER AGAIN.
Your hubby loves you and your body as it truly is, as it really is.
Any new man WILL JUDGE YOU.
As a woman with a 35 year old body competing with 25 year olds
as a woman being considered for a relationship with NO History and so all sex influences the direction of the relationship.
as a possible fling so your sex is just his passing fancy
Then again depending on how long it takes to get any new man assuming you dont want a ONS then it may be YEARS until you have ANY SEX AGAIN.
POSSIBLY NO SEX EVER AGAIN.
Ask your divorced friends. Really. Ask them about the sex. Watch their eyes as they answer. The longing, the wishing, maybe even shame. Go ahead.
And if you still want to do it….do it.
Your husbands next partners are EAGERLY standing by for that last GOOD LOVER.
And then ask them how many of them have made a run at getting their ex back, or at least trying to boink their ex after the frivorce.
Men are more desperate to get laid.
Women are more desperate for the security of a relationship.
Women think they have the power because of their pussy. Truth is that they have more to lose because of it.
Oh, I thought you knew it already. Forget it, not important.
Did she go past high school?
25 years ago…
My partner told me that she had received an invitation from an out-of-town old flame,
and was troubled that that perhaps he was “the One”.
I said “Go find out. I’ll spend the night with friends so that I’m not climbing the wall worrying”. I didn’t make any dumb-shit conditions about condoms or feelings.
Next morning “How did it go?”
“Oh, it’s over. Just a memory”
Ours was a happy house.
Considering Divorce? Try This
Look at Elizabeth Gilbert one might
Marry a guy seeking a green card one could.
Then turn lesbian one might.
Works fine if attention whore you are
husband is probably too beta…thats why they have a constant power struggle and she lost respect.
Husbands who love their wives are setting themselves up for failure
Much better for her and the family if Husbands rule over their wives
Beta comfort vs alpha tingles. and we know what happens to betas
Assuming she has lost interest in divorce for now, the “ongoing power struggle that is killing the relationship” would be the next problem to destroy. If it continues, then I expect she will quickly return to considering divorce.
Assuming she has lost interest in divorce for now, the “ongoing power struggle that is killing the relationship” would be the next problem to destroy
So how does one fix that?
“she is bored”…people who have any creativity and self-starting capability don’t generally get bored (unless they have to work nonstop at a boring job and don’t have time to do anything else, which doesn’t sound like it’s the case here) Doesn’t she have any hobbies? Any ideas for a part-time business? Any political or philanthropic causes?
She could do a lot more to explore her potential. She mostly lacks confidence, but blames that on her hubby holding her back. Which as far as I have seen he doesn’t, except when it’s a hair brained plan.
It is likely that he does give in to her too much, and rather than pacify her it seems to make her trust him less. So then she tries to run things. Then resents him for her running things. Yet she cannot just let go of the wheel and let the captain steer.
Power struggles suck. Nobody wins. Women today are taught the LAST thing they can do is relax, submit, or trust. The result? Constant struggle and strife when she could just let go of the wheel…. And enjoy the ride.
And true, if she let’s go of the wheel he could fail, or stumble, or make mistakes. Liz (miss you!) did this early on. She recounted a tale where she had a nice nest egg saved when they married, which Mike quickly burned thru, but she held her tongue. And he learned in time to manage the finances successfully. And they lived happily ever after… Or at least are now 20+ years later in a solid financial position. Together.
RPG,
You just reminded me of how Liz loves it when she gets a windfall. 🙂
Horseman,
Any time this woman this about divorce, she should read your comment. The reason they consider doing this is not to live like a nun. Somehow, they have to get the word that this possibility is very real.
It seems after reading real life divorce tales firsthand, she’s decided she doesn’t want to put herself …
She got frightened that it would negatively impact her personally. Most women are down with sacrificing their kids for another ride on the carousel.
I have to second the no-pressure sex comment by mgtowhoresman.
I’m married and I have this dorky love of romance novels. They are always about the starting phase of a relationship. Many women lose interest once that ‘exciting’ phase is over and books about the LTR phase are boring.
But it’s really the same as guys who fantasize about being James Bond. Fun in a movie, but IRL, they’d really rather NOT have people trying to kill them all the time. Being in mortal peril sucks. And so, TBH, does being in emotional peril. The can’t eat, can’t sleep, neglect the rest of my life because we’re too involved in each other phase is exhausting and stressfull. You can never get the same rapport with a new person, you can never have that sense of security in each others love. You have to go through awkward insecure not-knowing what pleases them, have to make new inside jokes, there’s no attachment. And nobody is going to treat your kids like their own father would. Nobody is as invested in you as your husband is.
I disagree with SFC Ton that loving and ruling are mutually exclusive, and am glad that my husband rules (and rocks!) in a loving way. He wouldn’t bother if he didn’t love me.
We are currently living in a tiny apartment in a bad neighborhoud, and we’re looking to move. I got so frustrated with my home that I started to neglect it, thinking it’s temporary anyway, why bother with deep cleaning and fixing stuff. And then it took a while longer than we thought to find something, so I decided to reorganize and just treat this home as if it were permanent. It’s SUCH an improvement! So much nicer here now.
Your friend, fantasizing about divorce, did the same as what I did with my home. She should’ve always considered divorce as a no-go, just not an option. Then she would have seen more ways to improve her relationship, and things would be better now.
People don’t realise that they will have the same dysfunctions in their next marriage (unless they have an addicted/insane spouse), so there’s no point in divorce. You have head start with any man who’s already with you, and except for a few rare MGTOW, they’re usually soooo easy to please. Especially since feminism, there are so few other women even interested in pleasing men at all. And a pleased man reciprocates with love and attention. Win-win 🙂
“And a pleased man reciprocates with love and atention. Win-win.”
Why do so few women see this? It is as if they want to kioll their relationship. Maybe that would be an exercise in control.
Indeed HappyHouseWifey, it really is pretty simple. The solution has been right in front of her all along!
Fuzzie, I think a lot of women project onto men what a woman would be thinking or feeling, then they start to assume that IS what he is thinking or feeling. I have literally seen women talk themselves into a fight with their hubby that’s actually going on in her own head!
The power struggle could very well be s#it testing, as well. If the hubby is responding by caving rather than pushing back, which while it would seem giving her her way would make things work, it in fact leads to her pushing the boundaries more and trusting him less when he doesn’t stand the line.
Plus she recently told me she grew up in a household with a violent, abusive father who directed that at her mother, not the kids, but that she always wished her mom would leave. Perhaps she’s subconciously recreating that as well?
She’s not very self introspective, so of course she thinks of only HE would change!
I dunno. But I know it’s making her, her kids, and her man unhappy. For no good reason.
RPG,
If I could tell her anything, I would tell her to be very grateful for the man she has. Maybe it it is just that simple. She will never be able to replace him.
I wrote a post over at Spawny’s
https://spawnyspace.wordpress.com/2016/10/05/trading-comments-with-a-rude-feminist/
It is best to be loved and feared, but it is better to be feared then loved.
Machiavelli ain’t just for politics.
@SFC Ton: respect =/= fear. Fear only inspires conditional, temporary loyalty… I am scared of spiders. Guess what happens to them?
If you become unemployed and sick and overweight to obese, would your woman stay and support you? I did with my man (he’s healthy and strong again and his own boss now btw). I did NOT fear him and still do not.
Maybe it’s just a matter of definition.
Most women would leave. That you hold yourself out as a unicorn is your business
That I tell men how to deal with the 99.999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999% of the women who are not is my business
I just meant to point out that had I feared him, I *would* have left. Just tough and no love means when you are weak, there is nothing left. And everyone has weak times in their lives.
It has been a long time since I linked a bar video.
A new post at Spawny’s there is
https://spawnyspace.wordpress.com/2016/10/07/she-longs-for-the-men-of-the-evil-patriarchy/
There is a new post at Spawny’s
https://spawnyspace.wordpress.com/2016/10/08/jealousy-unleashed/
From Rollo’s latest essay at The Rational Male
“At present there is no need for women to be anything more than arousing and sexually available. There are no ‘femospheres’ dedicated to women’s self-improvement that parallel that of men’s. Even “Red Pill Women’s” forums would be hard pressed to explain how they planned to improve their selves.”
Well ladies?
Care to step up?
or will the rationalizations commence?
A man’s preferred action. Not a threat. Not a cohersion. Just what a man will instinctively do once he has adapted to seeing his real value.
“The medium is the message.
You remove your attention and move on. Next play.
Her brief existence in your life doesn’t merit all that introspection about her behavior and possible future relationships.”
As open Hypergamy becomes obvious to even the dullest Beta man, his need and desire to serve you for little reward will clash against his self preservation instincts.
Do you merit this introspection at his expense?
Well?
Do you?
That bear ytube, I would be really scared.
Horseman,
I’ll go read Rollo’s post but, just guessing, he is pointing out that the sexual marketplace is so dominated by women that they don’t have to try anymore. Faced with this, the most natural response from men at the margins is to give up. Given that may apply to eighty percent of men via the Pareto Principle, that will be a lot of men before women notice.
Avraham,
I get the feeling that this is not the first time that man and bear have seen each other.
Mtgowhorseman, I do try here. What types of improvements modern women could make would you like to see me write about? I can always use more topic ideas!
Fuzz
Go read Rollo. its brilliant and I think right up your alley.
Bloom.
So much here and everywhere is dissecting what we already know. Hypergamy, AFBB, the 1:5 rule, lack of agency, daddy government replacing husband/father.
Lets assume that is all a given (or just provide links to dalrock, rational male, dangerandplay for a briefing)
Your target demographic is women 29 to 35 in pre ephiphany who see their timer is in under the two minute warning and MAAAAAAYYYBBEE there may be something off with the feminist agenda.
So. 1. how to break free of the feminist mindset.
2. hkw to recognize backsliding and continue to break free.
3. how to actually act to get quality men e.g. scenarios
4. how to be honest about the big questions (i.e. my number is 7+ but I am not a slut)
5. how to avoid the future pitfalls i.e. you are alphawidowed (by 30 you all are) so how to recognize and NOT get pissed off at joe average 6 months out for not being mr alphawidow.
6. the common evil thoughts im not happy, im repressed, im not tingly and NOT blow it up…again scenarios. h
http://theredpillroom.blogspot.ca/2013/03/youre-just-going-through-stage.html?m=1
Ian’s style was actual advice of what to do.
To differentiate yourself be the “okay I get it but what do I do now” girl.
Think of Rollo or Cappy vs Spawny (no offense glorious leader but we do rehash alot) Rollo writes infrequently but always with what to do.
Cappy just calls out the bullshit without navel gazing.
i.e. this one was not bad.
Basically you called out…you wanna frizorce….great. Here is how it really is.
Just my thoughts.
And no I am not going to do my own blog. This is a pastime for me. My writing is actually childrens books to get people to read to their kids at bedtime.
And you are about the only female other than judgybitch I follow.
You truly see and you have the guts to call it out.
Keep it up.
Bloom
Biggest idea.
Forget what men need to do for women for a second.
Marketing 101.
Women don’t want to be domestic.
A good catch is already successful so doesn’t care about your career.
Open Hypergamy has laid sexual freedom at the good catch’s feet.
So in say the Greater Toronto Area GTA pop 5 million. Assume 1% single 25 to 35 female. Thats 50,000 single women going after Mr Awesome or the population of my small city.
So competing with a small city of women for Mr Awesome.
What exactly do you have to offer and how do you market it.
p.s. if wome are here they know of the marriage disincentives, men 30+ just giving up looking and the hardcore MGTOWs.
Look at Athol Kay’s early MMSL BEFORE be sold out as a white knight pussy.
His early stuff was here is a scenario or real situation, diagnose it AND practical hands on (the ass) advice.
Then he followed the money and changed the tenor to follow the “Im not happy change him” money. But the framework was good.
Start with my situation. Married 25 years. On the road 4 hours a day commuting. SAHW with the kids leaving. The No Bank hit empty. And I said
“I have fulfilled my obligations as a father and husband. I am 49 and top 5% wage earner. I have 15 to 20 good years left. Give me a GOOD reason to stay or get out of my house.”
Mrs. H took a while but pulled it out of the fire. She bas backslid a bit but comes back on track quickly.
I know what worked.
See what your readers would do in that situation.
RPG,
I think that is high praise for you from Horseman.
There is a new post at Spawny’s
https://spawnyspace.wordpress.com/2016/10/10/the-intimidated-excuse/
People don’t care so much about self improvement. They care an awful lot about the consequences of doing or not doing something. That might be more attention getting.
Reblogged this on Red Pill Nation.
Much appreciated, Neroke!